LIVES OF THE LIGHT BRIGADE
The E.J. Boys Archive

IN PROGRESS — NOT FOR PUBLICATION

1330, Corporal John Burghersh FORBES — 4th Light Dragoons

Burghersh? Possibly also recorded as Burghursh, Burgersh, Barghersh, Burghesch, Burghesh.

Birth & early life

Born [1819?] at Dull, near Perth, Scotland, and christened there on the 13th of August 1819, the son of John Forbes and Mary Belcher.

His parents had two civil marriages (both on the same day) at Dull and Killen on the 29th of August 1819.

Enlistment

Enlisted into the 4th Light Dragoons at Maidstone on the 1st of January 1839 as No. 1120.

No other enlistment details are shown.

Service

From Private to Corporal: 1st of June 1849, while "On Command" at Sheerness.

From Corporal to Sergeant: 15th of July 1840.

In military confinement on the 11th of January 1842 and reduced to Private by a Regimental Court-martial on the 12th, no reason being shown.

Discharge & pension

Discharged, "by purchase", with a payment of £30, from Canterbury on the 8th of December 1842.

Re-enlisted into the 9th Lancers at Maidstone on the 10th of October 1845. No Regimental number was allocated as he did not join the regiment from the Depot.

Age: 24 years.

Height: 5' 8".

Trade: Clerk.

Appearance: Dark complexion. Blue eyes. Brown hair.

Service

From Private to Corporal: 12th of November 1845.

Corporal to Sergeant: 10th of March 1847.

Transferred (as Sergeant) to the 4th Light Dragoons on the 1st of July 1847.

Resigned to Private "at his own request" on the 13th of December 1850.

Tried by a District Court-martial at Athlone, Ireland, on the 22nd of February 1851 for "Embezzlement" but was "Acquitted."

From Private to Corporal: 25th of October 1854.

Corporal to Sergeant: 26th of February 1855, "by authority of Lt. General George Scovell, 4th L.D., dated the 13th of December 1854". This promotion may have been because of his conduct during the Charge, having been made Corporal on the day this occurred. Normal promotion was seldom recorded accompanied by any particular authority for this to happen.

Appointed to Troop Sergeant Major on the 22nd of July 1855.

The Regimental History states that he was Regimental Sergeant Major at Balaclava: "R.S.M. Forbes had two horses shot under him, but finished the battle on a third." This has now [1983] been admitted to be wrong.

Births registered

Mary Ellen Forbes [daughter], September Quarter 1867, York.

Colin Duncan Forbes [son], March Quarter 1870, Newcastle T.

Charles William Forbes [son], June Quarter 1872, Newcastle T.

Henry Frederick Forbes [son], December Quarter 1876, Newcastle T.

Discharge & pension

Discharged from Canterbury on the 3rd of November 1869. To go to the Cumberland Yeomanry — but he does not appear to have served with them. "Free, to pension after 24 years' service."

Served 24 years 24 days.

In Turkey and the Crimea: 2 years.

Conduct: "very good".

In possession of one Good Conduct badge when promoted and would now have had five.

Intended place of residence, "The Riding School," Bath Road, Newcastle upon-Tyne.

Medals

Entitled to the Crimean medal with clasps for Alma, Balaclava, Inkerman and Sebastopol.

Documents confirm the award of the Crimean medal with clasps for Alma, Balaclava, Inkerman, and Sebastopol, the Turkish medal, and the medal for Long Service and Good Conduct with a gratuity of £5.

Awarded the Long Service & Good Conduct medal on the 20th of December 1866.

He was granted a pension of 2/- per day.

Further medal information archived

Commemorations

Life after service

Appointed Staff-Sergeant on the Permanent Staff of the Northumberland Hussars Yeomanry Cavalry from the 3rd of November 1869.

1871 Census

Riding School, St Andrews, Newcastle.

John B Forbes, 51, Riding Master & Pensioner, born Scotland.

Mary Ann Forbes, 32, born Hampshire.

Vina Isabella Forbes, daughter, 21, born Ireland.

John Campbell Forbes, son, 8, born Ireland.

George James Forbes, son, 7, born Ireland.

Mary Ellen Forbes, daughter, 3, born York.

Colin Duncan Forbes, son, 1, born Newcastle.

1881 Census

Bath Road Riding School, Newcastle.

John B Forbes, 60, Army Pensioner & Riding Master, born Dull, Scotland.

Mary A Forbes, 39, born Hartley, Hampshire.

John C Forbes, 18, Clerk, born Ireland.

Geo J Forbes, 17, Draftsman, born Ireland.

Helen Forbes, 14, Scholar, born York.

Henry Forbes, 4, born Newcastle.

including 1 servant.

Discharge & pension

Discharged from the Permanent Staff on the 30th of October 1882, "on account of old age." He was then 60 years of age.

Pension increased to 30d. per day "for 12 years on the Permanent Staff" from the 19th of December 1882.

Conduct: "Highly satisfactory". Never entered in the Regimental Defaulter's book. Never tried by Court-martial.

A total service of 37 years 19 days.

Attended the first Balaclava Banquet in 1875.

Member of the Balaclava Commemoration Society in 1879.

1881 Census

Bath Road Riding School, Newcastle on Tyne.

The 1881 Census shows him as an Army Pensioner and Riding Master, aged 60, born at Dull, Scotland, with his wife, Mary A, 39, born at Hartely. Hampshire.

Two sons, one a Clerk and the other a Draughtsman, and a daughter, a Scholar, are also shown.

Commemorations

Signed the Loyal Address to the Queen in 1887.

Attended the Annual Dinners in 1890 and 1893.

Life after service

Death registered

Mary Ann Forbes, aged 47, June Quarter 1883, Newcastle T.

1891 Census

Bath Road Riding School.

John B Forbes, widower, 71, Riding Master, born Scotland.

John Forbes, 28, Merchants Clerk, born Ireland.

George Forbes, 27, Assistant Riding Master, born Ireland.

Colin Forbes, 21, Watchmaker, born Newcastle.

Charles Forbes, 19, Fitter, born Newcastle.

Henry Forbes, 14, Scholar, born Newcastle.

Two servants are also shown.

Death & burial

Death registered

John Burghersh Forbes, aged 76, September Quarter 1895, Newcastle T.

Died at "The Riding School", Bath Road, Newcastle upon Tyne, on the 31st of August 1895, and was buried in St. Andrew's Cemetery at Newcastle on the 3rd of September in Grave No. F402 — Consecrated.

Other interments in this grave are Archibald H. Forbes, aged 4 years, interred on the 24th of August 1878, and Mary Ann Forbes, aged 47 years, interred on the 7th of September 1883."

The gravesite (according to the cemetery records) was purchased by a Norah Forbes on the 6th March 1966 [sic] and there is a large headstone to the grave. The inscription on this reads:

"John Burgersh [sic?] Forbes, 4th (Queen's Own) Hussars, who rode in the Charge of the Light Brigade, October 25th 1854. Died August 31st 1895, aged 76 years."

(There are photographs of the stone in the 4th Hussar file.)

See the 4th Hussars file for a portrait engraving (and also a photograph of him in uniform and on horseback) obituary and funeral reports, kindly provided by the local history librarian, which appeared in a local newspaper [unknown source], but probably the Newcastle Journal for the 2nd and 4th of September 1895. Also a copy of a photograph of his gravestone, which appeared in the "Evening Chronicle" for the 11th of November 1954.

In his will he left his estate of £809 to his son, John Charles Forbes, a Book-keeper.

Further information

In December 1976 an advertisement appeared in the Radio Times for a brand of chocolate sold in an envelope type of pack. The theme of this advert was based on illustrations of old postal envelopes and covers. One of these was addressed to "Troop Sergeant Major J.B. Forbes, 4th Light Dragoons, Balaclava Camp, Crimea." Enquiry of the advertising agent revealed this to be only the envelope — there was no letter. (See copy of this in the 4th Hussar file.)

Top right: "Envelope received after the Charge by a member of the Light Brigade, 1955." Advert for After Eight chocolate, Radio Times, [date?] 1976

[PB: I chanced upon the image above on the internet — it is not the one in the archive. FIND and, if better, substitute.

(Click on image to enlarge)

A Mr. J.E.B. Forbes, then aged over 80, also contacted the agents, who passed the letter on [to EJB]. In this he had thoughts of the Troop-Sergeant Major being possibly his grandfather. Further enquiries of him revealed little or nothing to substantiate this claim. Only the possession of a tinder-box, said to have used by his grandfather in the Crimea and the thinking that the letter "B" in John Forbes's initials possibly stood for his own of "Barraclough." He was also unable to connect any family history with the Newcastle area.

One very interesting point did arise from the correspondence, however. His late wife's grandfather, a Mr. Charles Drake, had been the official photographer to Lord and Lady Cardigan. He (Mr Forbes) possessed a glass negative of a photograph of "Ronald", the horse said to have been ridden by Lord Cardigan at Balaclava, taken on the day of its master's funeral in March of 1868. (See the "Officer Commanding and Brigade Staff" album for a copy of this.)

(Click on image to enlarge)

In view of its interest an enlargement was made and presented to the Museum of the Royal Hussars in Mr. J.E.B. Forbes's name.

In 1967 a Colonel Savage of the R.A.M.C. (T) wrote to Canon Lummis:

"I am the possessor of the off fore hoof of "Ronald," the charger ridden by Lord Cardigan. It was given to me by my maternal grandfather, the Reverend John Harwood Thill, F.S.A., the Rector of Cranoe, in Leicestershire, who was his chaplain.

In 1954 a letter was sent by one of John Forbes's grandchildren to the then Colonel of the Regiment, Sir Winston Churchill:

"Sir,

Upon this historic occasion of your Centenary Dinner commemorating Balaclava, it occurred to me that the Regiment might be interested in his very real connection with Balaclava itself.

Only recently was my attention drawn to the notice relating to your Dinner, otherwise I had it in mind to write to the Regiment at a date nearer the 25th of October. However, I am hoping so much that these enclosures will arrive within sufficient time for my grandfather's picture to be with you all during your celebrations so that his memory may be honoured with your toast.

I feel sure that his spirit will be amongst you all, as you will observe from his obituary notice that he kept faith and contact with his beloved Regiment until the last.

I would also like to think that these enclosures will, in some measure, be the means of bringing to life to his old Regiment, not just a legendary figure from the past, but a very real Christian gentleman.

His children, there were six; of whom one still survives, were brought up in the conditions of Balaclava; to do their duty and not to reason why. As Shakespeare has written: "This story shall the good-man teach his son... From this day until the ending of the World, but we in it shall be remembered — we few — we happy few, we band of brothers... And gentlemen in England now a-bed shall think themselves accursed they were not here, and hold their manhood cheap while any speaks that fought with us upon St. Crispin's Day." (for the 25th of October, the anniversary of the Charge, is also St. Crispin's Day.)

Ever thus is the glory of our Island's history and tradition upheld and memorised by deeds of great valour. Deeds which can never lose their power to stir British hearts with pride throughout the centuries.

And now it only remains for the grand-daughter of Regimental Sergeant Major John Burgersh Forbes to commend his memory to you all and to salute the Regiment in his name, and finally to wish you, all of you, a most joyous evening.

Yours in faith and pride,

Ailsa M. Stewart."

References & acknowledgements

Additional birth and death registrations, and Census information for 1871-1891, kindly provided by Chris Poole.

To follow up

• Wendy Leahy, Shadows of Times website: John Burgersh Forbes

SURNAME: Forbes

FORENAMES: John Burghersh, also recorded as Barghersh [?], Burghesch and Burghesh

BORN: c1819

AT: Perth

OCCUPATION: Clerk

REGIMENT NO: 1020

2nd REGIMENT NO: 1330

ENLISTED: 01 01 1839 or 10 01 1839 London

June 1847

Recorded as 10 10 1843 on transfer entry

TROOP NO: 1839: Depot Troop

1840: Depot Troop

1842: Depot Troop

RANK: 1839: Private, Corporal

1840: Corporal, Sergeant

1842: Sergeant, Private

1847: Corporal, Sergeant

3Q 1847: ___, Waterford 3rd muster

4Q 1847: Sergeant, Waterford

1Q 1848: Sergeant, Waterford, Waterford, On Command Dublin

2Q 1848: Sergeant, Waterford, Waterford, Carlow

3Q 1848: Sergeant, Piltown

1850: Sergeant, Private

1854: Private, Corporal

1864-1865: Troop Sergeant Major

1867: Troop Sergeant Major

1869: Troop Sergeant Major

PROMOTIONS: Private to Corporal 01 06 1839, Depot

Corporal to Sergeant 15 07 1840, Depot

Private to Corporal 25 10 1854

REDUCTIONS: Sergeant to Private 12 01 1842, Depot

Sergeant to Private 13 11 1850. Reduced at own request and by authority from Lt. General Sir G. Scobell commanding 4LD.

NOTES: 31 03 1842 From Depot Maidstone [to Regiment]

2Q 1864: Good shooting pay. Entitled to an extra 7s 7d. per quarter

3Q 1864: Good shooting pay. Entitled to an extra 7s 8d. per quarter

1Q 1865: Good shooting pay. Entitled to an extra 7s 6d. per quarter

3Q 1865: Good shooting pay. Entitled to an extra 7s 8d. per quarter

4Q 1865: Good shooting pay. Entitled to an extra 7s 8d. per quarter

MEDALS: Crimea: Alma, Inkerman, B[alaklava] clasps. List dated 07 01 1855.

TRANSFERRED FROM: 9th Lancers 01 07 1847

TRANSFERRED TO: Camb. Yeomanry Cavalry 01 08 1867 York

ADMITTED TO OUT PENSION: 02 11 1869: [Newcastle]

PENSION DISTRICT: [1869]: Newcastle

1873: Newcastle

DISCHARGED BY PURCHASE: 28 12 1842 £30

DIED: 31 08 1895 Newcastle

TNA SOURCES: WO/12/648-652

WO/12/655-656, WO/12/659, WO/12/668-671, WO/23/62, WO/180/24

[Source: Wendy Leahy, Shadows of Times: John Burgersh Forbes (accessed 16.4.2018). The editors are very grateful to Wendy for allowing us to include information from her website.]

16 April 2018, Wendy wrote:

It's an interesting middle name that he had, and one which gave the regimental clerks plenty of trouble in recording it. Probably an old family surname going back...

I have here a couple snippets from my draft involving old John B:

On the 22nd of July 1847, shortly before leaving Dublin, George Clout forfeited one good conduct badge. It was the eighteenth anniversary of his enlistment, and he would not regain the badge for one calendar year. He was then stationed at Waterford where he remained for several months.

In March 1848 Troop Sergeant Major Henry Jennings and Sergeant John Forbes accompanied George on command to Dublin. By April the three men had returned to Alexander Low's troop at Waterford and Clonmel.

Incidentally, this being sent 'on command' to Dublin in the company of two senior NCOs is a bit of a mystery, especially as it comes amid two forfeitures of good conduct badges which appear to be George's only blots with the regiment. It might have been completely innocuous but I would love to know what it was all about.

In June 1858 young George spent another seven day stretch in the cells at Aldershot and in September 1858 the Fourths removed from Aldershot to the Midlands, some troops being stationed at Coventry and others at Birmingham.

Amongst those stationed in Birmingham was Private William Proffitt, a recruit of little over one year, who ran amok in the town centre on midday one Saturday in early December. Police constable Jinks managed to arrest him after Proffitt had 'struck and kicked Jinks with his spurs in a very savage manner.' Jinks had asked the dragoon, who was the worse for drink, to return to his barracks.

Proffitt appeared in the police court and was charged with 'drunkenness and violent conduct in the public streets.' Troop Sergeant Major Forbes testified that the soldier was a bad character of drunken habits and 'the Magistrates sent the silly fellow to gaol for seven days.'

And from my Newspaper webpages, which are a long way from being online:

7 September 1895, Huddersfield Chronicle

Sergeant-Major Forbes, of the Northumberland Huzzars, died on Saturday morning in Newcastle. Deceased was born in 1819, and at the age of 20 he joined the 4th Light Dragoons, going through the Crimean campaign. He was one of the Six Hundred at Balaclava, and was taken prisoner, but was subsequently exchanged. He had a happier fate than many survivors of the famous chargem for he was nearly 30 years with the Northumberland Hussars.